Level of knowledge and experience

[nomenclator]

Anyone know how much knowledge and experience I'll need in php, sql, MySQL, phpMyAdmin, and MS Access, before there is a good chance I'll be able to land a job at a local company doing something with databases, that pays better than minimum wage data-entry jobs?

I'm in the process of going thru this tutorial.

[swirlee]

It's a mixed bag, but expect most companies to require at least two years of actual in-the-field experience.

One of the best ways to get experience (i.e. to escape the "how do I get experience if nobody will hire me until I have experience?!") with PHP is to contribute to various open-source projects. There are plenty out there, so pick a project you're interested in and find out how to contribute.

[nomenclator]

Contribute to an open-source project where some kind of database is being developed to place and access information into a MySQL database, using php? Like contribute the development of phpBB or something? Write a mod for it and get it approved? I can't think of anything else open-source offhand. I'm getting a mental block.

[swirlee]

In my opinion, while writing mods or plugins is good experience, contributing to the actual core code is better, or at least looks better on a resume.

There are literally thousands of open-source PHP projects out there that want contributors. Go to SourceForge. They currently have 9,570 PHP projects. Or check out their PHP Foundry for some of the more active ones.

[Alexej Kubarev]

I believe the best thing is try to create fully functioning websites and web applications (in most cases its the same thing).

That way you will even have some things in your portfolio to show to the company... but the problem might be that you not only have to code good, but desigh good as well..

[nomenclator]

I think source forge and php foundry are over my head, swirlee. Certainly, this page, that claims to answer the question "what is a foundry" didn't provide an explanation that I could understand.

I started at this page and clicked "next" until I got up to this page. Took me about 2 8-hour days to read it and understand about 95% of it.

I practiced what I learned there, using a test database, a MySQL database, om my web site at OurHernias.org. And of course, using phpMyAdmin, I looked over the 29 tables in the database that the message board, http://OurHernias.org/phpBB2, reads to and writes from.

All I am learning now is using MySQL Monitor; using SQL queries within php to query a MySQL database; using html forms and php for insterting data into a MySQL database; and using phpMyAdmin to administer a MySQL database. A side benefit is that I can query MS Access with SQL queries instead of using the MS access menus, but I wouldn't say I am learning much about MS Acces. I just want to be able to create forms, using html and php, so that people can enter and retrieve info into and from MySQL databases consisting of a handful of tables, maybe 1/2 a dozen -- not big databases with 100's ot tables -- i'll never do that as a student.

I don't anticipate ever becoming really good at this -- I just want to be able to make databases of, say, names, addresses and phone numbers; people's video collections; store inventories; medical records; and simple stuff like that. I don't think I can get much more knowhow than that by education, only by on-the-job training and experience. I can only stand education so long. Then it has to get real, or I run into a mental block.

[Alexej Kubarev]

Like i said:
create different dynamic websites so that you get practice...
It wont take long for you to learn everything

[nomenclator]

I already have made a few web sites. They aren't particularly esthetically pleasing though, or sophisticated. They are rather simple. I don't think my work is going to be very impressive to a corporate organization.

Earthly Origin of commercial Materials Educational Organization
Our Hernias
Nutcracker Web Site Development Services
and I contributed a little bit to
Long Island Networks

[Alexej Kubarev]

okej... well.. i ment a bit more complex php sites using both php and mysql. with a litle HTML and lots of PHP
like a community site or a webshop or something like that
or a portal system..
will also be nice if you make just scripts.
look at http://www.hotscripts.com for a bit more "inspiration"

[nomenclator]

I have no inspiration. I've made very slight alterations to the scripts that make http://OurHernias.org/phpBB2/index.php work -- note that I changed the "post subjects" in the headings over the messages to display in bold instead of the regular typeface -- but obviously I can't say I wrote or contributed to the development of php Bulletin Board.

What would be inspiring would be if someone said here's some money and this is what kind of database I want. And it wasn't something too far beyond my present skill level.

[Alexej Kubarev]

Well... i can understand you... i had the same inspiration about 3 weeks ago..

One person said: Here is $5000 and i want a webshop done by the 15th december, demo by 1st november..

Sounds nice, dont you think? The only problem is the amount of work and a huge number of extra funktions a client wanted.. :-S

Well... hmmz...
Imagine this:
Go and make a simple forum, you should have a pretty good idea how it works by now i think... so go and make one..
then upgrade it till its perfect

THAT would be a great thing, plus willl look nice in your portfolio..
Forums do not need lots of pictures and stuff.. so its almost a bure coding..

You always talk about databases. only databases... i dont really think that ANYONE would need just a database administrator.. so what you need to do is be a SYSTEM ADMINISTRATOR.. or something simmilar..

[nomenclator]

"what you need to do is be a SYSTEM ADMINISTRATOR."

I'm outta luck then.

[Alexej Kubarev]

sorry mate

[swirlee]

One person said: Here is $5000 and i want a webshop done by the 15th december, demo by 1st november..

Sounds nice, dont you think? The only problem is the amount of work and a huge number of extra funktions a client wanted.. :-S

That's not so bad. Raid PEAR and half the work is done. Unless the functions he wants are particularly bizarre.

If you get any more offers like that, you can always send them my way.

[Alexej Kubarev]

HEhe.. sure :P
Its just that i dont use pear at all... and that webshop is a really weird project...
I had problems in saving XLS content into MySQL, plus XSL wasnt containging any kind of common structure... so all of the columns are mixed... and that XLS file was supposed to contain prislist with products and so on...
so it was so freaking irritating... took me 2 days to build that function..

[nomenclator]

Thanks for informing me about pear. I can't really figure out what it is tho.

Ya know I figure there must be something I can be employed at somewhere in between being a data entry clerk, and being an experienced database administrator. It is hard to believe that I can only find employment at one extreme or the other. Although I am male and I rarely see males working as data entry clerks. The only male data entry clerks I've seen are like specialists -- I saw one once working as an accounting data entry person -- with knowledge of accounts payable entry forms, a-r, payroll, etc.

[Alexej Kubarev]

hehe... yah.. this means that you need to be a specialist in something

[bezmond]

become a specialist in making tea/coffee :-D

Heh - only kidding, hope you find something !!

Andrew

[nomenclator]

"become a specialist in making tea/coffee"

I'd be perfectly willing to do that, I don't mind that kind of work at all, but I would not be able to earn a living doing it because (1) they hire almost exclusively females and (2) they pay wages that won't pay for my bus fare there and back.

Someone who works in information technology told me that php-mySQL database skills were in particular demand now.

[Alexej Kubarev]

jupp... that was exactly what i told you... php and mysql, not only mysql...
so it would be a good idea to learn php scripting too